Corporate report

DPTAC Main Committee meeting minutes September 2022

Updated 13 February 2024

11am to 3pm, 15 September 2022, online.

Attendees

DPTAC: Keith Richards, Will Bee, Chris Price, Tanvi Vyas, Roger Mackett, Matthew Smith, Jessica Uguccioni, Mike Brace, Niki Glazier, Bryan Matthews, Sharon Brennan, Sue Sharp, Helen Dolphin.

Guests: Business Disability Forum (BDF), Disability Rights UK (DRUK), Mobility and Access Committee for Scotland (MACS), Scope, Transport for All (TfA).

Welcome and introductions

DPTAC Chair welcomed all to the meeting, set out housekeeping arrangements including the requirement for confidentiality as appropriate. Apologies noted from David Mapp and Dave Partington.

The Chair reminded members about disclosing any conflicts of interest; Keith is on the board of Transport Focus and co-chair of the Heathrow Access Advisory Group.

DPTAC mentioned they are working with South Western Railway on their toilets study.

Disabled Persons Organisation discussion

The Chair introduced the session as part of an ongoing conversation and engagement process with disabled people’s organisations (DPOs). Topics for discussion included transport policy concerns and the deepening financial crisis. The Chair invited DPOs to raise their concerns.

Scope

DPTAC presented on behalf of Scope. Scope were working on a Passenger Charter as a priority.

Concerns mentioned included rail staffing reductions, airport accessibility failures, the cost of travel, the Disabled Persons Railcard, inconsistency in service, staff training, and what disabled people can expect.

Scope explained to the Chair of DPTAC’s Aviation Working Group that they intend to focus more on aviation after the Passenger Charter is launched.

Action: Chair of DPTAC Aviation Working Group to follow-up with Scope.

Business Disability Forum

The Business Disability Forum (BDF) raised concerns on the increasing cost of fuel and its impacts on access for disabled people to get to work. DPTAC asked BDF about disabled persons access to taxi services.

Action: BDF to follow up with the group.

DPTAC identified the potential for BDF to carry out research and gather evidence on issues affecting disabled people and whether the business community is aware of any issues with disabled people affording travel to work.

The BDF mentioned that they have been seeking insights from members and disabled workers and that they had not been into details of specific journey types.

Transport for All

Transport for All (TfA) presented their activities and concerns, including the launch of a new Accessible Transport Survey.

TfA highlighted key topics, such as:

• the need for accessibility to be treated with the same gravity as safety and sustainability at all levels of government via funding, culture, and training
• building in accessibility from the beginning, including engagement with disabled people from day one – future-looking reforms should not take us backwards
• TfA would like the new Transport Secretary to recommit to the Inclusive Transport Strategy and provide funding for this
• there are still concerns surrounding COVID-19, with many disabled people choosing not to travel – current travel patterns are not a reliable basis for decisions about future plans
• the impact of the cost-of-living crisis on disabled people

Action: DPTAC to continue to raise issues with DfT.

DPTAC comments included the potential impacts of staffing changes on accessibility and risks to community transport which may reflect vulnerability in social enterprise funding models. TfA noted Transport for London’s unique funding of free dial-a-ride, which differs from regional funding models.

Disability Rights UK

Disability Rights UK (DRUK) presented to the group with the following;

Ticket offices have been used as information points, which is a key factor for disabled people; moving staff out would make them less visible.

One issue raised by DPTAC was digital exclusion, with many disabled people who cannot or choose not to use technology. This may become a barrier to using transport. DRUK are pushing back on special offers for online booking.

DRUK suggested cross-industry communication during disruption is important as people are too siloed. Disabled people need to be involved in mitigations and the industry needs better reporting channels for incidents.

Priority seating notification on trains is often out of eyelines and people often face abuse; this needs a low-cost approach. DPTAC suggested moquette colours could achieve this.

The Chair summarised the discussion and thanked participants.

CCAV and autonomous vehicles

The Centre for Connected and Autonomous Vehicles (CCAV) presented and stated their concern is on how to make sure vehicles and services offered are accessible.

DPTAC expressed interest in the proposed accessibility advisory panel with industry and the representatives of users. DfT said that the suggestion of including lay panel members is one to look at.

DPTAC noted one of the big challenges of self-driving tech is not knowing what the layouts or services might be. Policymakers will need service providers to be open about what is not working and make people feel comfortable raising issues without fear of losing permits.

DPTAC suggested it would be important to build collection of experiences and data into the system. DfT agreed and pointed to the Law Commission recommendation for a monitoring and evaluation process for evidence provided by operators.

DfT agreed with MACS that it would be good for MACS to be involved as this is a GB-wide project.

The Chair thanked DfT and invited ongoing dialogue.

Inclusive Transport Strategy

The Chair set out the background and DfT presented on the context to the Inclusive Transport Strategy (ITS), its current work to review existing commitments, and the future work to be done.

DPTAC enquired about monitoring and evaluation work; views on the past and future of the ITS and the approach to developing new commitments and noted the impact of COVID-19 on travel patterns. DfT mentioned there was a case for action including wider questions about the ambition and structure of the ITS, and that new opportunities will be found through engagement with stakeholders and a consultative exercise if new commitments are developed.

MACS shared that Scotland has its Accessible Travel Framework, with 2 years to run, which was similarly affected by COVID-19 and suggested DfT may wish to talk to the lead of the Accessible Travel Framework at Transport Scotland.

DfT asked about DPTAC’s vision of a fully accessible transport network, as if the 2030 ambition is to be recognised as achieved, we need clarity over what we mean by the ambition precisely. The Chair pointed to the fully accessible railway paper; having a picture and target date is important.

DPTAC suggested that confidence in using transport can fluctuate as new things come in, so futureproofing by having accessibility built into the long-term vision is important.